Posts belonging to Category 45 ACP



Glock 21 and 30 factory loads chrono’d

I am a sucker for ballistics, although admittedly their value is often over-stated and people spend far too much time arguing which one is “better.” Choosing 115gr vs 124gr vs 147gr should not be a traumatic experience :) However, I find it interesting when we get real world data.

Here is a great thread from: http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?96214-Factory-ammo-chronographed-in-G30-and-G21

Since I am looking to get a Gen4 (29 or 30) in the near future I found it interesting. Especially since it includes two of my favorites: Speer GoldDot and Hornady TAP.

Highlights:

1. Remington Golden Saber 230gr
765 fps/ 805 fps

A mild to shoot load. Pretty weak as well. Unlike the others (except for #2 this one is a few years old.

2. Federal 230gr Hydro Shock
810 fps/ 830 fps
Another older and very mild to shoot load.

3. Buffalo Bore 230gr JHP (Montana Gold bullet) +P
—/940 fps.
One thing about Buffalo Bore is their bullets go as fast as they say. When I pulled the trigger on this load I had to really hang on to the gun. Big kick and big boom. Truth in advertising but pretty usless for point shooting or any one handed shooting. I did not bother with the G30 test.

4. Hornady TAP 230gr +P (XTP bullet)
847 fps/ 865 fps.
Heck of a nice load. Easy shooter for full power. Obviously +P means different things to different ammo makers. This is a great full power 45 acp load.

5. Hornady TAP 200gr +P (XTP bullet)
938 fps/ 965 fps
Also heck of a nice load. Plenty of speed but easy to shoot. Outstanding load.

6. Speer Gold Dot 230gr
802 fps/ 846
Good standard pressure performance and as gentle as can be. Made the G21 feel like it was shooting marshmallows. Easier to shoot than the Hornaday loads.

7. Speer Gold Dot 200gr +P
997 fps/ 1050 fps
Woof! I didn’t know Speer had it in them. This load is a rocket! Recoil and blast are really up there though. With enough practice I could learn to shoot it well but not without specific training (remember… point shooting, on the move and either hand). It’s an awesome powerful load but too much of a good thing at least for me.

8. Double Tap 230gr JHP (Gold Dot’s)
860 fps/ 890 fps
This is the load I carry when I’m toting a Glock 45. It’s a standard pressure load that moves the bullet very very fast. I reshot them last weekend in a direct comparison to the Hornady loads above. I could not tell a recoil difference. Easy, fast and accurate. The only downside is they are only occasionally available from Double Tap.

Let’s add some more from: http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19298

Highlights:
5 shots ave with each rounds. Chronograph 12 feet 65 70 deg 2500 feet el.

Glock 21. Glock 30

Double tap 185 +P. 1119 fps. 999 fps
Rem 185+P. 1126 fps. 1096 fps
Rem golden saber 185+P 1094 fps. 1033 fps
Rem golden saber 230. 856 fps. 813 fps
Corbon 185 +P. 1127 fps. 1108 fps
Winchester 230 SXT +P. ??? 875 fps

Google-FU is strong on this topic (http://glocktalk.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-1305515.html):

corbon 185jhp +P 1127 fps 1108 fps
rem 185jhp +P 1143 fps 1096 fps
double tap 185jhp+p 1119 fps 1060 fps
rem golden saber 185+P 1092 fps 1033 fps
rem golden saber 230 856 fps 813 fps

Interesting that the Rem GS load is significantly higher than what FirearmsTactical and the person above got (both in the 1030ish range).

Some short barrel 45 (Chrony) ballistic results along with random thoughts vs 40S&W

Updated: 01/07/2013

Updated with additional loads and GL21 vs GL30 info

I really want something like a Glock 30 or an Officer’s size 45ACP pistol. Mainly because the shortest 45ACP I own has a 4.25″ barrel.

I like big bullets but I also like them to go fast — hence why I am a 10mm fan. Spare me how you don’t need speed. My first pistol was a 5″ 1911 and that was a long time ago. I don’t need to be sold on the fact 45ACP it works. I am not debating that. However, the 45ACP is an incredibly LOW pressure round @ ~18,500 CUP (how old school is CUP?) it WILL lose velocity quickly with shorter barrels. It is one of the main arguments that 45GAP has going for it (loses little in say a 3.5″ bbl platform).

Conventional wisdom would say that, on average, a round will lose 20-30-40-50 fps per 1/2″ or barrel loss. I know quite a range, no?

Doing a little looking I was able to find some info posted by the late Stephen Camp. I trust his #’s 100%. For those that didn’t know him, he was a gentleman and also a HiPower guru. It comes from this THR thread: http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-102573.html. This is good info and is pretty close to BBTI’s estimate of 787fps.

The most significant result is that, at least to me, (very) short barrel ballistics for the 45ACP is virtually identical to short barrel 40S&W. The 40S&W loses little in a 3.5″ platform–in some loads as little as 30fps from a 4″–when comparing 40/180 to 45/185. Keep in mind that a 40/180 gives you the same sectional density of a 45/230. I know that to a lot of folks 45/230 is still king and might think it blasphemy to move away from 230gr you might find it noteworthy that John M. Browning actually designed the 45ACP to be a 200gr bullet. Anyway, I find 45/185 to be very accurate. A 40/180 just as accurate, much more common and cheaper to shoot.

Stephen A. Camp
September 21, 2004, 12:45 AM
Hello. As part of a project I’m doing, I recently borrowed a Colt Defender, a compact variation of John Browning’s 1911. Several different commercial loads were chronographed to see just how much velocity these short barrel pistols lost.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid139/pd1df4a71d3bb361154843750ed5db12d/f70042cd.jpg

The gun’s owner replaced the factory grips and installed/fitted Swenson ambis as he’s left-handed.

I had a ballpark idea but had never checked any of these over a chronograph as I don’t own any 1911 pattern pistol with shorter than a 4 1/4″ barrel.

That does not mean that other folks don’t and I figured the results might be of some interest to them. Figures are based on 10 shots fired approx. 10′ from the chronograph screen.

Remington 185-gr. MC-Flat Nose:
Average Velocity: 923 ft/sec

Federal 185-gr. Classic JHP:
Average Velocity: 885 ft/sec

Corbon 200-gr. JHP +P:
Average Velocity: 958 ft/sec

Sellier & Bellot 230-gr. FMJ:
Average Velocity: 722 ft/sec

Winchester USA 230-gr. FMJ:
Average Velocity: 765 ft/sec

Federal 230-gr. Hydrashok:
Average Velocity: 799 ft/sec

Winchester Ranger 230-gr. JHP:
Average Velocity: 797 ft/sec

Winchester Ranger 230-gr. JHP+P:
Average Velocity: 866 ft/sec

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid139/p1d156f457cdd806908ddd0a8721f5c65/f70042d4.jpg

The Federal 185-gr. JHP (left) and the standard pressure Winchester Ranger SXT (RA45T) were fired into water and both expanded nicely. The Federal JHP’s jacket separated. This is more common in water than in tissue. The SXT round expanded slightly less than when fired out of a 5″ barrel. A police officer who attended a Ballistics Seminar
put on by Winchester advises that they do recommend use of the +P version in pistols having less than 4″ barrels to insure more certain expansion should the bullet pass through barriers before striking the target.

Best.

Since I mentioned the Glock 30 here (from http://www.firearmstactical.com/test_data/45acp/rem45-185gs+p-g30.htm) is the Remington Golden Saber 185gr +P clocked:

.45 ACP Remington 185gr +P Golden Saber Brass JHP
Test Weapon: Glock 30, 3.8″ bbl Bare
Gelatin Denim Covered
Gelatin
10 rd Avg. Velocity: 1034 fps
General-Purpose Combat Capability Optimal Satisfactory

and

GL 30 230gr HydraShok average 813fps

and some more…

Some Kimber 5″ Custom vs 4″ Kimber Pro (15′ from muzzle):
5″ 185gr Remington Golden Saber 1153fps
4″ 185gr Remington Golden saber 1007fps

5″ Corbon 185gr +P 1185fps
4″ Corbon 185gr +P 1041fps

Here is a really good page with Kimber CDP 3″, Cold Commander 4.25″, Ruger BH 4.6″, and Colt Govt 5″ (!) chronograph ballistics: http://stevespages.com/page8f45acp.html

Wondering about the G21 vs G20? Well, I have some data from a website no longer available too:

Corbon 165gr BHP+P —————————– 1160 vs 1096
Federal 165gr Personal Defense —————– 1083 vs 1023
Remington 185gr Golden Saber ——————- 961 vs 913
Remington 185gr+P Golden Saber —————– 1040 vs 993
Win 185gr SilverTip —————————- 922 vs 875
CorBon 200gr+P JHP —————————– 1072 vs 1019
CorBon 230gr+P JHP —————————– 937 vs 904
Fed 230gr HydraShok —————————- 919 vs 860
Hornady 230gr+P XTP —————————- 943 vs 886
Rem 230gr Golden Saber ————————- 852 vs 825
Win 230gr SXT ———————————- 889 vs 840

Now I am off to find some 357magnum short barrel ballistics. Have a good night.
Settle down, Angus!

Colt Awarded Contract from U.S. Marine Corps – Guns & Ammo

in case you haven’t heard yet

http://www.gunsandammo.com/2012/07/20/colt-awarded-contract-from-u-s-marine-corps/

New S&W 4566TSW Melonite!

Ok, non-believers (some people still don’t believe they exist) here is a pic of WVSP’s new S&W 4566TSW Melonite w/ Rail! It is from this smith-wessonforum thread.

The sku for the new pistol is 108263. So, if you are interested please contact S&W or possibly special run distributors (like Lew Horton) and let them know (I did). If they run them, I will buy one!

Any interest in scanning my original 45 Super info from the originator Ace Hindman?

So, this 45Super THREAD ON SIGFORUM got me thinking…

Is anyone interested in some of the original documentation that I have from 45 Super creator Ace Hindman? Somewhere around here I have original correspondence, including hand-written instructions on beefing up a 1911, his actual pressure test results from Federal and Hodgdon, his handload data, how to cut and ream 308 brass to 45Super (historical significance since Starline 45 Super is now available) and original reviews and write ups from various magazines, books, etc. Ace was truly a gentleman and believed in sharing his work. He was very helpful to this poor, Top Ramen-eating, college student who only owned one pistol at the time. I couldn’t afford the Ace Custom 45’s conversion for 45 Super but that didn’t stop him from helping me.

It will be a significant amount of work to find this stuff, scan it, and post it, so if there is no interest I won’t bother. Please email me (or use the contact page option) if you would like to see the material.

Or just use the poll below…

Ruger to introduce 1911 on April 18? Leaked photo..

So, supposedly on p 119 of “Combat Arms” there is an AD of the June issue of “Shooting Times” (confused yet?) with the pistol on the cover. Oh, and supposedly Ruger has a new pistol announcement on the 18th. Coincidence?

I am a little disappointed that it isn’t built on the Zytel/polymer frame like the P345. This would reduce the weight, give you replaceable backstraps, add checkering to frontstrap, etc. That surely would have made it stand out (and also piss off the 1911 purists). Oh well, the purists have yet another 1911 to chose from. At least it doesn’t have front cocking serrations.

Anyway, here is a pic of the pistol…(click to enlarge)

That leaves remarkably few that do not make a 1911. HA! When I bought my first one in 1990 people made fun of me because of the “wonder-nine” craze and said that the 1911 and 45ACP were done. Double-HA!

SwampFox, serious 10mm ammo

Have you guys heard of SwampFoxGunWorks.com?

They have been getting excellent reviews for providing full power 10mm (and other calibers). Several people on various forums have confirmed SwampFox’s velocity #’s which are amazing. I just ordered some myself.

Check out this 10mm 200gr XTP load @ 1325fps!

http://www.swampfoxgunworks.com/swampfox/product.php?productid=17681&cat=397&page=1

(WARNING: For supported chamber pistols only!)

For those pistols without a fully supported chamber like Glocks and quite a few 1911’s I got this load:
10mm 200gr XTP @ 1240fps (still smoking!) I got a box of this too for my Colt Delta Elite.

http://www.swampfoxgunworks.com/swampfox/product.php?productid=17522&cat=343&page=1

I have been looking for a “thumper” woods load for camping/hiking/etc. And have selected this 200gr JFP (full power 1325fps). Again WARNING: For supported chamber pistols only!)

http://www.swampfoxgunworks.com/swampfox/product.php?productid=17721&cat=386&page=1

These loads are exactly why I bought a pair of S&W 1006’s!

They offer 5 round packs so that you can try the ammo, and will custom load to your specs!
They also offer other calibers like 45ACP+P and 357magnum. I am a big Hornady XTP fan, but they do offer other popular bullets too (Golden Saber, SilverTip, Gold Dot, etc).

Can’t wait to try it out! (More info to come later)
I am not affiliated, just a big fan of full power ammo.

Cool S&W 3rd Gen (4506) being fired

It’s from here: LINK

Click the picture to enlarge:

Recall on Federal 45ACP ammo :(

In case you haven’t seen it yet:
http://www.federalpremium.com/pdf/45_Auto_warning.pdf

Details are in the link above, but in a nutshell AE, Champion, HiShok, and HydraShok that fall under these lot #’s:

38X628 to 38X765
38T401 to 38T414